Citadel Upkeep -- possible future changes

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Citadel Upkeep -- possible future changes

Post by Dr Brad » Wed Dec 31, 2014 10:19 pm

From the Clan Leaders Forum:
Mod Moltare wrote:TL;DR Should we reduce upkeep costs and increase building costs to partially compensate?

Gentlebeings,

I'm aware that capping in citadel is a sore point for some clan members and a reason not to join some clans that demand it; that it feels obligatory - to stop citadels degrading - that you as clan leaders demand that everyone cap, and that you manage quite tightly the locks on citadel plots to avoid having every clan member use their allowance on cloth only to fail upkeep on pbars or wood etc.

In the longer term, and I can make no promises to time frame at the moment, I'd like more uses for clan resources such that resources from capping are desirable to the player on a personal level as well as the clan. That wouldn't be for a long time yet as other priorities vie for our limited development and testing time, though, so I'd like to make a smaller change in the mean time.

How do you feel about cutting upkeep costs for citadel buildings, at the tradeoff of making the buildings themselves more expensive?

Essentially:

- We'd seek to rebalance the costs for buildings such that a complete citadel at any given tier had as much upkeep cost as 5 people capping could just about handle weekly.
- We'd increase the price of buildings in the citadel such that the extra resources you would have spent on upkeep over the course of the time taken to construct the building are rolled into that spend instead.

As such,

- Getting your citadel built would take about as long.
- A clan which fell on hard times would be less likely to dilapidate.
- Players would still be able to claim the same amount of XP etc weekly by contributing to their clan,
- but you'd be able to reach upkeep costs earlier in the week,
- so you could unlock all plots and allow more people to spend their limit on skills they want XP in.

For comparison, scroll down to some figures for current and proposed total upkeep costs (including the ore and charcoal needed for bars)...

UPKEEP

Old -- Upkeep total -- Members needed for upkeep

T1 3005 4

T2 6010 6

T3 9405 7

T4 15005 9

T5 20040 11

T6 31435 14

T7 52500 20

.

New -- Upkeep total -- Members needed for upkeep

T1 3005 4

T2 5409 5

T3 6960 5

T4 8253 5

T5 9820 5

T6 11002 5

T7 13125 5

.
BUILDING

Old -- Building total -- Members' weekly cap needed to build

T1 4710 5

T2 21855 19

T3 50275 36

T4 113780 67

T5 219260 110

T6 438200 187

T7 968900 359

.

New -- Building total -- Members' weekly cap needed to build

T1 4710 5

T2 22839 20

T3 52789 38

T4 119469 71

T5 229127 115

T6 457919 195

T7 1007656 374

As you can see in the first pair of tables, upkeep has been flattened to be (just under) 5 members' worth except in the case of T1 (which is already less than that). The second table shows the new total cost for buildings (not decorations) at a given tier; they've been adjusted upwards by about 5% to increase their price by the same number of (members capping) as have been cut from upkeep. Decorations will be adjusted similarly.

In short, if your clan has fewer than that final column of numbers, you'll benefit from the cost adjustment. Clans of fewer than 21 people will now be able to progress up the citadel tiering; obviously this means more T7 citadels will exist, but this is an outcome I am content to allow since there are currently fewer than the Clans team would like. And clans of 5 people will be able to maintain a citadel, if they're highly precise and disciplined about it (although it's a distinctly tricky prospect and I'd always recommend having more members than that).”

- Mol
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Re: Citadel Upkeep -- possible future changes

Post by Princess Selene » Thu Jan 01, 2015 11:33 am

That would be a great change! Thanks Brad. :)
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Re: Citadel Upkeep -- possible future changes

Post by Dr Brad » Thu Jan 01, 2015 2:59 pm

If you'd like me to provide any feedback on the Clan Leaders' Forum, please post here.
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Re: Citadel Upkeep -- possible future changes

Post by SnowAngel » Thu Jan 01, 2015 8:06 pm

Dr Brad wrote:If you'd like me to provide any feedback on the Clan Leaders' Forum, please post here.
I like the changes but you could ask them the question everyone asks. Will we be getting new skill plots in the citadel anytime soon or ever?
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Re: Citadel Upkeep -- possible future changes

Post by Dr Brad » Fri Jan 02, 2015 9:13 pm

SnowAngel wrote:
Dr Brad wrote:If you'd like me to provide any feedback on the Clan Leaders' Forum, please post here.
I like the changes but you could ask them the question everyone asks. Will we be getting new skill plots in the citadel anytime soon or ever?
This doesn't answer your question directly but you can probably guess what the response would be to your inquiry:
Mod Maz said:
*runs off with silk and lines nest* *notices an acorn has been stolen and summons the dark undead squirrel armies to hunt down the culprit* *noms a breakfast acorn*

Why are citadels so hard to update? Sit down and I shall tell you!

First, if we want to change or add anything to the map, we have to change approximately 450 map squares, individually, by hand. Then they all have to be tested.

I also have to change the code that controls all the customisations/plots etc throughout the citadel, which is one of the most large and complex pieces of code there is in the game. This then needs to be tested for as many citadel configurations as possible... and there's lots of them as you can calculate yourself. If I get this bit wrong I can potentially break all of your citadels. This would be a bad thing (TM).

Clan citadels was one of the largest projects we have ever done. Most of the entire development department was involved at one point or another and it took approximately 13 months from start to finish. I'm quite proud of the fact that I played a small part in that.

Hopefully this sheds some light on things?

It's not that we can't change it, it is the time and resource needed to change it that is the restrictive factor.

*yawns* time for squirrel nap now.
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Re: Citadel Upkeep -- possible future changes

Post by SnowAngel » Sat Jan 03, 2015 4:07 am

Thanks, Brad. By the looks of that, I would say the answer is never.
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Re: Citadel Upkeep -- possible future changes

Post by xNightshade » Mon Jan 12, 2015 2:56 pm

SnowAngel wrote:Thanks, Brad. By the looks of that, I would say the answer is never.
I guess it depends on demand for it. If enough people make a noise at the same time, the higher the chance it's going to be heard. Though i'd assume never too hehe.
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